New Leica T (Type 701) Camera Soon? First Images?
Rumors are afloat once again and this time it is about the new Leica T type (which was rumored a few months back). It was hinted then that it may be an APS-C mirrorless camera with lenses made with a partner (for the most part) and some high quality primes to be made in Germany. When I 1st saw these rumored images (that were supposedly taken from the instruction manual of the camera which is said to be hitting in April) I hoped they were not real. Then I thought..no way..fakes. Then after seeing more, including a page from the manual..I thought..maybe. But who knows.
To me it looks like a Sony NEX from 3 years ago.
So is it real? Is this the new Leica mirrorless that will be made in Germany but come in at a more affordable price? They do need to be making something in that shiny new factory so we shall soon see. But personally, I hope these are fakes. 😉
If this is the new T type, what are YOUR thoughts? The image below has what appears to be a 23mm Summicron T, which would make it a 35mm in APS-C land. This would be the 1st mirrorless interchangeable lens camera made by Leica in Germany besides the M.
Interesting read, not convinced the photos are 100% legit as of yet but we’ll see soon enough.
An X2 with interchangeable lens. The EVF is an option, now the camera is moving towards $4k. Price a Fuji X-T1 with an 14mm, 23mm and a 56mm lens… hey you can a Fuji outfit, with three of their best primes for about $4k. But as we all know, Fujion lens are very poorly made and have very poor optical performance, yea right.
I think these pictures a real. Starting a new mirrorless system with AF, APS-C sensor and high quality primes is a good idea. Fujifilms X-system shows us that there is a demand for cameras like this. But Leica really should habe included an high quality EVF, this is a key feature for serious amateur users.
Forget the included EVF but maybe an internal Flash ( see the Leica T skeleton body from http://www.hypebeast.com ???)
mfo
Interesting discussions here, but one thing is for sure, Leica is only an niche photo product producer, and this small company has not enough finacial power to develop high tec themselves. All the technical stuff must be purchased from other specialized companies, incl. the digital sensors! Like it or not – Sony eats presently Leica’s lunch!
Interestingly, the new T-bayonet diameter seems to be larger than the Leica M attached. This could lead to the hope that Leica will start with an APSC system first with the option to go FF later, like Sony did with NEX E-Mount and Alpha 7 and EF lenses.
I met Dr. Kaufmann today at NAB in Las Vegas. I was in the Leica booth looking at the M240 for the first time when he walked up and introduced himself. He ask me if I had ever seen the camera. I said I had but this is the first time that I actually held and operated it, referring to the M240. He said, no, this one, and held up a camera that looked almost identical the one pictured at the top of this article and then quickly pulled it back down concealing it. Smiling he said…three weeks. So we’ll see!!!!
Strange situation…. Dr. Kaufmann cannot make this type of mistake!
The “pictures” on top of this article are pure “fake”.
Personally I see no “miracles” but a Leica X vario with intercheangeable APS-C 24 mb
Leica-Panasonic fixed and zoom lens is possible .
mfo
I saw it only for a split second but definitely had the same or very similar form factor. The grip area might have been a bit more sculptured. It was quick.
The lens looks askew in the second image.
“horses for courses”couldn’t have said it better thanks Jack Larson
Hi Steve, how do I know your latest or recent camera’s reviews you have made?
Thank you
Not bad, a APS-C Baby Leica, which costs in real life much more than a Sony A7 FF Body….eeeh,
but the Sony doesn’t have the red dot, for many ppl that is way important. 😉
I got a message,, that Leica is going to introduce their new mirrorless system camera, on April 19, 2014 at 19:00 MEZ!
not 19 april 2014 but 24 april 2014…
Leica Mirrorless System coming on April 24, 2014 Berlin 7 pm…
MFOConsulting
please work on a perfect firmware!!!!! the firmware of X2 und X Vario are……. far to slow!!! and with little bugs
Hello to all Leica T 701 speculators… Phase II
In 2006 Photokina , Leica create on the Panasonic basis an M43 body : DIGILUX 3 !
In 2014 Leica will create an APS-C based on a Panasonic GX7 body ( pure speculation yet ).!
My concern the future Leica T will be build on the basis of the Leica X vario with intercheangeable APS-C lens from Leica Solms and Panasonic for zooms.
But Panasonic has never been involved in the APS lens brand.
That’s very strange …and not cohérent strategy from Leica Solms.
mfo
Hello to all Leica T 701 speculators…
What about the legendary Leica Digilux 2 ( 2004) as the basis body for the new Leica T 701 ( 2014) ?
mfo
Curious… why would anyone sit around and speculate on something like this? why would you not simply be out in the world, living your lives? shooting? earning money? Do you realize that all of the comments are from men? sitting around speculating about a camera company you do not work for, nor control, much less profit from? just some food for thought… but I stumbled across this and find the entire thing pointless. Most of you – from the sound of the comments – dont even shoot Leicas… or can’t afford to shoot them. I am ashamed I wasted this much of my life writing this. back to life!
Mr. Black,
Let people speculate on the new Leica T 701 .
Your comments about people are out of the subject.
Sorry
MFOConsulting
Think Samsung! Good cameras but no marketing or recognition. Excellent manufacturing facilities, and more important, piles of money. The Koreans would get a boost from German reputation and Leica would benefit from a “new” partner. Only potential drawback is a close relationship might make Leica a valid
take-over target. Ricoh would also be a potential partner but is still wallowing in the Pentax merger.
I’m enjoying the speculation about a relationship with sony. Recent announcements by sony, selling off their television unit and less than satisfactory financial results, makes me wonder how much scrutiny their camera efforts can take. They’ve certainly been modestly successful with their DLSRs, barely better in
their point and shoot efforts, and the whole NEX business – while interesting “little” cameras – are hardly a rounding error in the overall photographic market. Indeed, with the exception of the Zeiss sourced products, the Sony lenses are hardly exemplary. In fact, the only reason Sony may have to keep the capability may be to provide lenses for their cell phones. Leica has had previous relationships with Fuji and Panasonic, so either one would be a better choice that Sony has a “new” partner.
It’s clear…. Fuji X-E2 = Leica T 701
Any comments ?
mfo
Maybe It’s an M4/3 with better IQ then the Vario X …
I don’t think that Pana is producing Lens for APS-C .
FUJI has expertise on APS-C sensors and excellent bodies for this type of lens…
Fuji+ Leica : Will be the winner in APS-C .
Any contradictor on the field?
mfo
Don’t forget, Zeiss sits already in this boat!
Zeiss Lens + Leica bodies : two Germany companies associated in the same brand :
Impossible for economical and historical raisons!
mfo
You know what, the more I looked at this, the more I think this is NOT an APSC mount. The proportion doesn’t look right. i am thinking this is a m43 mount. Can some one do a proportion check?
Since Leica denied a m43 camera, my guess is it is a variant of m43 (slightly adjusted sensor dimension ratio) but compatible with m43 lens…. just hoping.
so you bet they go against theyr crown jewels? Yeah, let them shoot their knee.
Doubt it totally.
Carlos,
Pana and Leica are complementary for some brands ( Lx5 and D-Lux 6 = best cameras and my favorites).
My dream about the future T 701:
body like D-lux 6 with incorporated lvf ( gx7)
mount APS-C .
zoom 24-120 mm 2.0-4.0. made in Germany ..
issue no 1: dimension of the body!!
But I agree with you about the fact that Leica produce Lens for Panasonic cameras like GX 7 (M43)
and Leica is not able to produce body cameras for M43!!
Now It seems that Panasonic is creating Lens for APS-C mounts?
Doubt it totally.
mfo
Carlos
If Leica was innovative, it would be very smart for them to do just that. In the computer world the phrase is known as “Eating your own lunch!” As opposed to waiting for someone else your eat your lunch for you. The concept is to create innovative products that render your existing products obsolete, and induces your customers to come back and buy again. In the past Hewlett Packard and Apple were masters of doing this.
With the right design, features, and implementation, the the T(701) and its follow on products could give Leica a product that could let them reach a wider audience, iterate new ideas to carry them through the next 60 years, and let them keep the M system for the purists.
Paul B
The Leica T 701 will be:
– Body like Pana GX7 WITH
– APS-C 20 MB instead of M43.
Price: 3 X Pana GX7.
MFO
I think what it will come down to is price. If this has the IQ of the X Vario and comes in at a decent price point with a good lens bundled then it can be a contender. The X Vario has amazing IQ when you have some light. So does the X2. if this guy has that IQ with nice build, speed and lenses while coming in at a good price (no $3500 price tag please) then it will be a success.
Nex3N is available now around 199$, so lets say 5 times the price, we have 1000$. To compete on the market, this camera should sell around 450$. All beyond that will make it obsolete to be considered, except the red dot folly for sure. To me it looks like a first hour Samsung NX1000. It has the same body shape.
I like it. Tends to remind me of the original Leica Dlux (which I own). If it will accept M glass, and offer an optional viewfinder, I’m a buyer.
I think I would like to add my $0.02 to the conversation. To begin with there are a few tings to consider
1. Leica is a trailing edge company. So they are unlikely to develop a new camera line with a new and unproven sensor size.
2. The owner of Leica has stated publicly that Leica will not produce a M43 camera. So this is also unlikely.
3. Leica will not endanger the position of the M line, or the S line, so a full frame sensor is unlikely.
4. Leica does need a viable entry point into the system that will attract new users. Much like Porsche, Mercedes, and Audi need entry-level cars to attract new drivers.
5. Therefore a variation of an APS-C sensor is left.
Next, there has been a lot of speculation about this body being a rebranded Sony NEX, but to me it looks like a cross between the Fuji X-M1 and the Fuji X-E1, with a different top plate. There are other similar design cues such as the oval pop up flash and the button/sensor on the front of the body. Considering that at one time Leica did have a relationship with Fuji, it is not a far reach to think that Leica couldn’t license manufacturing rights for themselves and/or another partner. Though, I think Leica will continue their working relationship with a current sensor manufacturer.
For lenses, if the new camera is going to be successful the lenses will need to be auto-focus. In addition, if the camera is going to be a conduit of new users to the M-system, ideally it should use the M-mount or come with an M-to-T mount adapter. Naturally, the highest quality lenses would be made in Germany, though the remaining lenses will be made by a partner, as previously mentioned, but the quality would still be worthy of being included in the system. Considering the image quality produced by the Leica designed Panasonic produced M43 lenses, I would suggest that Panasonic is more than capable of making a new lens line to meet any optical standard.
PaulB
Yesterday I had the opportunity to take a good look at a Sony NEX-7 and mentally compare it to the visual cues in the photos above. Many of the visual features of the top plate in the photos above match features of the NEX-7. So I am going to change my opinion in the message above and agree with the others that have said this looks like a NEX-7 body. The one feature that pushes this change is the location of the flash. In the photos above, and on the NEX-7, the flash is located between the grip and the lens, and on most Fuji bodies the flash is on the opposite side of the camera.
Considering Leica’s history of incorporating their own menus and other software changes into camera bodies they use from a partner, this camera will probably will be more visually similar to a NEX-7 than functionally. The big question will be, “Will the body and lenses use the Sony E-mount (renamed to T-mount), or will the lens mount be exclusive to Leica?” I would expect an exclusive mount to justify Leica branded lenses.
I guess we will see in a few months.
PaulB
No , the Tandem Sony-Leica is not possible due to the agreement with the Zeiss company…
I see the new tandem with Fuji-Leica or again Panasonic-Leica .
But there is a big issue with Panasonic: No APS-C dodies or lens yet produced.
Only bodies and M4/3 sensors and lens…
Wait and see until 1 april 2014…. Poisson d’Avril ?? maybe!
MFOConsulting
Did the design team from the Nikon V2 get recruited away to work on this?
What a strange looking Panasonic.
Can’t see it matters, Leica make up such a tiny percent of total camera sales what they do or dont do is irrelevant. They are a niche company with niche products that appeal to a niche clientele – which is fine as it seems to work for all parties concerned. But they have little influence in any real metric that matters.
That looks terrible. Why can’t they just make an interchangeable lens version of the Leica X cameras. Irrespective of price and performance per dollar I think the Leica X2 and the X Vario are good looking cameras.
Please Leica! Stop wasting your time and money on the past heritage and move forward. Don’t ruin your name by doing this.
NEX heritage???
Far too little, way too late…
thats the only complain I have too: Waaaaaay too late.
Looks like a coop with SAMSUNG!
… my thought as well, though, some NEX elements are visible, too…
I cant say why, but I am absolutely sure, they are not fake. This is how the new T model will look like. I think the most wierd thing is the silver/metal color. Imagine this camera in black and it will look not that bad to me.
By the way, there is nothing wrong with a NEX like design.
The point of this camera is not the camera body. It’s all about the lenses.
It totally makes sense to me.
There’s a lot wrong with NEX design.
@Michiel953
>There’s a lot wrong with NEX design.
No innuendo, content please…
Many thanks in anticipation!!!
Only one word for this camera. UGLY. But it is typical of all Leicas. Ugly, and yet sexy. Ironic doesn’t it?
Just another Lunar if this photo is true 🙂
This camera is a LINO: Leica In Name Only.
an unfortunate design if true , ironic that leica , almost singlehandedly kep the corner vf alive for over 5 decades is going to give a half hearted design like canon m and other simple minded fails
take a page out of fujis playbook leica ! they have certainly mined your gestalt with the x line , which is carrying digital photography into a better place that it has languished for years
get a clue leica , its free
It looks ugly, and photoshop’ed. 😉 some kind of NEX7 in Leica-Design, hardly.
No EVF – not selling…but, otherwise a have a DP2 Merrill w/o EVF, too.
I will join in with all the speculation. Leica excels at making lenses. It has proved it can deliver a zoom lens on an APS-C sensor camera (the X Vario), although this was stymied with its slow speed. Therefore the logical thing would be for Leica to develop an X Vario-type camera with auto-focus interchangeable lenses, using a zoom as it’s kit lens and being able to accept its M lenses. This would effectively resemble a Fuji XE2 but with the bonus of the Leica lens and branding.
This would not directly cannibalise sales of the M because of the different shooting experience. However, it would pose an interesting dilemma to those about to buy a Sony A7. I cannot foresee a full frame version, as this would surely cannibalise M sales. Whilst I’m not in the market for Leica equipment, I could see a market for that. Especially if it had a more retro design than the rumoured image suggests. Pricing would be about the same as the X Vario was at launch.
Just my opinion.
HI,
I mostly agree with your post. However, I don’t feel it will impact on those contemplating an A7, simply because the Leica appears to be APS-C, whereas as you know the A7 is full frame, and in my opinion FF appeals to a different mindset.
The highest quality APS-C and m4/3rds cameras have such high IQ that I am sure that this is more than most people will ever need.
I bought into the Nex system and have an ageing 5N which has such good IQ that I have never felt the need to upgrade to another APS-C body. However, I was irked by the crop factor using my Leica lenses and with M bodies being way over budget for me, Sony’s A7 became a godsend.
Leica would certainly make sure that their excellent FF lenses could be used on this body, but it will come at the price of the crop factor.
Leica doesn’t really HAVE to do anything. Someone somewhere will always buy a Leica. It’s always been the case. Even the “dud” M5 sold reasonably for a time. Why should they “better do something soon”?
There will always be someone who wants to put their mug in a selfie holding a Leica… 😉
Leica better do something soon in the land of AF/Mirror Less. Sony is way ahead in the A7/R for MP race and Fuji new camera will be a super speed in both low light and normal use, both will have world class lens on Leica’s level. Bye the Bye any body read the review of the new CZ Sonar 55mm f1.8 for tha A7/R from Digital Camera Review. Super sharp, for too bad it is not 35mm.
Leica as an upper class mainstream brand. Who would have thought that. I guess they need cashflow just like anyone else. Although, with their pricing and slightly antiquated technology, you’d think the cash was already there in abundance. But what do I know.
No EVF. No Dice.
Is that tri-Nav I see? 🙂
I’m only interested in Leica for their rangefinder cameras as no-one else makes an optical rangefinder digital camera, let alone one that uses Leica glass.
If I want to shoot a different mirror less option, I’d pick a Fuji XE2 or Xt1, or an Olympus OMD.
A re- badged Fuji XT-1 would suit me fine!
Well, it doesn’t “look” like a Leica, so I doubt it’s legit. Leica’s been pretty consistent with keeping a certain aesthetic, I doubt they would make something that looks like an old Sony camera. But then again, I was comply wrong about the RX1…
I actually heard about this camera back in Miami during art basel. I believe the nickname for this is Typhoon… and at the time I was told it is going to have a software development kit for it. Being that take a iphone for example… what makes it so good is the apps. The back is suppose to be mostly a screen and you can add features to this camera when needed. Curious to see if they followed through with that in the final product.
I think it’s fake but PLEASE, Leica, don’t go in this direction!!! The ugly thing doesn’t even have a built-in viewfinder. I abandoned the NEX system because the lenses were so freaking huge. Don’t make that mistake here.
The comments in this thread speak volumes. The question is can Leica take off their ear muffs long enough to hear it? Another very small market niche camera like the X Vario is not going to help Leica succeed and survive. However, the company just doesn’t seem to get the digital age and is extremely slow to fix problems. For example, the M240 still has issues where it locks up and no fix is available a year after it starts appearing. The company is very lucky that they have buyers that will put up with that kind of customer support, especially in this price range. It would be like keeping your Mercedes if it stopped running unexpectedly on the freeway on a random basis. How long would you keep the car if the company did not provide a fix just to be able to say you had a Mercedes (or pick any luxury brand)?
I beg to disagree. The comments here are gibberish written by people I would guess have never owned a Leica and never will. The company’s financial and product success answers all of this criticism. On the other hand, as I said above, maybe Leica should hire some of the geniuses commenting here and “fix” everything.
By the way, the M240 is a brilliant camera, built like a tank, dependable and wildly successful.
I doubt you have used, or own one. Mine works perfectly, as do those owned by all my photographer colleagues.
To chime in, I agree (as many of you know) that the Leica M240 is fantastic. Still my #1 and fave camera. Something about these M’s that are special and to those who own them and use them, 95% of them agree.
I don’t know Jack. The M240 is not “brilliant”. It’s also not “built like a tank” if you have to keep getting the rangefinder tweaked over the life of the camera. Yes, if you baby your “tank” you may not have to but it’s a fact of life that dishing out any major abuse to these so-called “tanks” require eventual adjustment of that delicate backwards rangefinder optical system. Wildly Successful? How so? Because it got a tonne of Leica users to dump perfectly good M9s because they just had to have it for the bling/Leica factor?
Sure there are some people around here who have never shot a leica and they’re throwing stones. There are also an awful lot of Leica film camera users (like me) who honestly see the latest M as a return to the bloated (and failed ) M5 design that got Leica a few buyers.
None of the Magnum Leica guys ever said their cameras were “tank-like”. They were small, reasonably fast and light-weight. They all sent their cameras in for the same regular tune-up so they could get sharp pictures.
Don’t make it sound like Leica can do no wrong. They can do plenty wrong. Their boss made his fortune in the supermarket business, not the optics business. He’s just a shareholder. Look to Hasselblad to see what happens when shareholders run a company.
Leica T, my view and step-approach to it.
1) it won’t be a M4/3
2) it’ll have an EVF, optional at least
3) it’ll be APS-C, as it’s placed between X and M systems
4) it’ll be a System camera
5) it’ll be Leica Design and Partner-pre-produced, then finalized in the German factory for MiG stamp.
6) it’ll never use the M-lenses naturally, but have an own mount: T
7) it’s Leica’s response to Fuji. Hardly to Sony.
8) no Retro design, as that’s covered by Fuji and Nikon, but pure simplistic time-less Leica Design
Well, yes, it’ll be a “Leica NEX”, just pure design-language and higher in price, slightly above Fuji.
With Lenses smaller and better than Sony’s big chunks and a longer life-span as a system, much like Fuji’s philosophy.
You’ll have the choice: NEX-7, Fuji X, Leica T, or go higher with an customer available A7 prototype, or the M, or, if you’ve got time to wait, with a late entry by Fuji into the Full-format league.
I’d favor any Fuji or well made T over the NEX. There’s a chance to grap the top spenders in that super-competitive market. It’s not about Leica needing to take the whole market. Being a selling #3 should be enough for them, to give entry-points into the Leica M system, i.e.
Take a T and an old M lens and shoot the Leica-way. Get more great lenses, step by step and soon, you’ll be on a hunt for an M. Yes, a NEX or Fuji could do that, too, but you’re looking at the brand from outside. That’s a status differentiator for many. There’s a selling moment, if the cam’s a good tool at a not too high price, compared to the top-range of the competitors.
ciao.
Its hard to imagine Leica bothering to compete against Fuji or Sony. Leica is not a company that is going to pump out new models each 3 months and drop the price each 2 months.
Rather, Leica will make a camera that just works, and does not need an array of buttons to do what the camera should know how to do by itself, and pages of menus filled with features that already exist in Aperture. My guess is that they either take the FF sensor they have, or a M8 sized sensor, and build a camera around that.
It’s fugazy .
Leica would use their 24mm design , not a 23mm .
The front tells me little. I want to see the back.
The only way that I’d consider it is if it takes existing lenses to get me “into” the Leica M system to later upgrade to an M240, etc. If it was like a digital Minilta CL. Otherwise, what’s the point?
Who knows? If it’s a M43 camera it better be within a few hundred dollars of the Olympus OM10 or if it’s a
APSC it had better be priced closely to the Fuji X systems. The “Leica mystique” may not be as powerful
with the soccer mom crowd that buys the purse cameras and the built-in distain of M shooters may limit
the marketplace no matter how good the technology is. Sure, we all love the distinctive look of the M lenses, but on a small sensor the critical edge sharpness is not so big a factor. As for a “japanese partner”, I can only guess the bottom line impact of the Panasonic branded offerings currently available.
Personally, if the price premium is typical, I’d rather buy the Fuji and additional lenses.
Who would want this? I think Leica are dumbing down their product line and debasing their name. Did anybody read the AP news article available here
http://www.amateurphotographer.co.uk/photo-news/540341/nikon-responds-to-flagging-csc-sales
Looks like new entrants into this market will have a tough time.
This image reminds me a 1920’s German classic movie, Metropolis.
NEX C3 body with NEX 7 top plate twin dials. Looks horrible to me.
1. I think they are fake but I would not be surprised if Leica did something in this direction
2. Leica is now selling well the M line which is understandable as only a few thounds M bodies are being manufactured per year (1% or less of the total market)
3. So Leica could make a cheap M body to sell more lenses or make a new body with a new mount and lens a new lens line. They could make use of some cooperation (Panasonic)
4. Leica is in a good position to do this. They are selling well.
5. But from a photographer’s point of view and old time Leica owner, the new approach of this company is a departure from the past. HCB does not need a Leica today. If you want top notch quality you may go for Leica but you do not have to. And the investment is very conspicuous as digital bodies get old fast. It is very unfair to coma per an M6 with an M9. The M6 was in production for 20 yrs, the M9 lived only 3.
M43 is good enough for most and lenses are small. APSC may be a little better but lenses get bigger. FF is Leica business with small lenses but prices are high. Sony has FF bodies but forgot the lenses (see NEX…)
Cheers
Mattia
Samsung NX300?
That’s actually a very good camera.
Interesting… in more ways than one.
I don’t any great design or technology from Leica when it comes to the body – lenses are Leica’s specialty – so I wouldn’t be surprised to see an ugly body with a 3 year old design.
But apart from competition between camera manufacturers, we also have competing sensor formats with Micro 4/3, APS-C, and Full Frame. My feel is that APS-C has been losing some ground lately due to the improved performance of M4/3 and lower cost full frame. So will Leica help bolster the APS-C area?
Also, we know that Leica is committed to a very high standard of image quality, and small camera bodies and lenses (and they’ve criticized other manufacturers for not making systems small enough). So here are the interesting questions that come to mind:
1) Will Leica’s entry into APS-C sensor market bolster it? Will all 3 formats (M4/3, APS-C, and Full Frame) still be around in 10 years?
2) Will Leica maintain their commitment to IQ if/when they move into the APS-C arena (ie. will the APS-C Leica produce better images than all other M4/3 and APS-C cameras/sensors?)
3) Will Leica maintain their commitment to small lenses and systems (ie. do they have some special design in the works and will their APS-C lenses be both better and SMALLER that other APS-C lenses and perhaps even rival the size of M4/3 lenses?)
4) Who will be the mirrorless APS-C champ? Leica or Fuji??
These are the things I’m waiting to see.
“1) Will Leica’s entry into APS-C sensor market bolster it? Will all 3 formats (M4/3, APS-C, and Full Frame) still be around in 10 years?”
—
APS-C doesn’t need bolstering. Nikon, Canon, Fuji, Richo, Pentax, Sony, and others use it. M4/3 is only supported by 2 manufacturers, and Panasonic’s mirrorless camera sales are tanking.
“2) Will Leica maintain their commitment to IQ if/when they move into the APS-C arena (ie. will the APS-C Leica produce better images than all other M4/3 and APS-C cameras/sensors?)”
—
In terms of sensor quality, no. Sorry to say it, but the sensor in the M240 comes up short when compared alongside the current state-of-the-art Sony sensors. Unless Leica sources top-notch Japanese sensors, then they’re only real advantage is their excellent optics (and even here this is a matter for debate, depending on which lenses are being compared).
“3) Will Leica maintain their commitment to small lenses and systems (ie. do they have some special design in the works and will their APS-C lenses be both better and SMALLER that other APS-C lenses and perhaps even rival the size of M4/3 lenses?)”
—
That really comes down to whether or not Leica choose to build a series of APS-C lenses, and if they are autofocus or not. If they’re autofocus, they won’t be smaller than, say, Fuji’s current lenses.
“4) Who will be the mirrorless APS-C champ? Leica or Fuji??”
—
Quite possibly neither. Canon and Nikon will dominate this segment as soon as they commit to entering it in a serious way. But this won’t happen until they see mirrorless significantly eating into their DSLR sales. So far, that ain’t happening.
@Robert Falconer:
Many bold statements. Credibility of these would require evidence to be produced,
So – please do so – otherwise they come over as idle hyperbole…
You bet.
1.) Nikon / Canon / Pentax / Fuji / Sony / Ricoh / etc all produce APS sensor cameras. Only Panasonic and Olympus build M4/3 sensor cameras. You can look this up easily.
2.) The Leica M240 sensor produced by CMOSIS in Belgium underperforms against the state-of-the-art Sony Exmor sensors in dynamic range and low noise at high ISO. You can check this on DxO Mark. Compare the A7/A7r/D800 sensors to the CMOSIS sensor.
3) If you believe that Leica — who are generally rather inexperienced at producing autofocus lenses — can produce autofocus APS series lenses smaller that the current Fuji X Series lenses, by all means let’s see your evidence to the contrary.
4) Who will be the mirrorless APS champ? Now, here things get a bit more dicey, and I agree I am injecting a certain amount of opinion. But it’s informed opinion. Of the two options Mars Observer suggested, Leica or Fuji, I think the win here — if we’re talking about unit sales — goes to Fuji, as they already have the production and selection momentum going. They’re also a much bigger company with far more electronics know-how than Leica. Moreover, how good will a Leica entry be? How much money will it cost? How much will the lenses cost? I just can’t fathom Leica being the “champ” here. Now, what did Mars mean by “champ”? That’s another question. If we’re talking about IQ, WAY too many variables here to even being predicting.
As to Nikon and Canon, they utterly dominate the photographic industry right now with respect to camera sales. If they decide to go heavy on mirrorless — and they do it properly — they have that established momentum to draw upon.
btw: I failed to mention Olympus here, which was an oversight on my part. Right now Olympus’ mirrorless sales dominate everyone else, and are way out ahead of Fuji. If Nikon and or Canon enters mirrorless in a significant way, Olympus will likely feel the heat first. On the other hand, the current E-M1 is such a well-sorted product, that I remain cautiously optimistic they’ll hold their own. The real wild card here is Panasonic, who are hemorrhaging camera sales badly. Not sure what they’re going to do, but their various divisions are under pressure to be profitable right now, or face the axe.
I am now using a Leica M240 with 28, 50 and 90 mm lenses. None of it is state of the art. But I enjoy using this kit way more than my Nikon D800 when it comes to street, travel and landscape photography. There is something about the M series – the simplicity combined with excellence in the IQ that cannot be matched by the Japanese computers/cameras.
The M system has “soul’, that provides a photographic experience that has become unique in this day and age.
Haters only hate it because they either dont appreciate that the qualities of the system beyond test charts or they have issues with the prices.
I am by no ways wealthy but i have spent a lot of my hard earned salary on photo-gear. Most of it is dated after a short time and once the novelty of having a new camera has worn off, they are much of a muchness. Soul-less computers that all take sharp and correctly exposed photos.
The M240 is wonderfully crafted, has fantastic classic lines and once mastered, very simple to use. Photography is not just about the photos themselves but also about the enjoyment of using certain types of equipment, the feel good factor when doing so and the picture-taking process itself. Leica gives me all of this plus unique IQ. Having an M system makes me want to use it and to take better photos.
I cant justify the high prices. Its a shame that they are priced as they are. It’s not for everyone – but those who are buying for the right reasons (not just for posing) know what they are buying so appreciate for what it is and accept what it is not.
If that’s it I’m declaring myself not interested now. It makes the Canon EOS M look reasonable. It looks like an antique Samsung. Leica are being left well and truly behind, and the idea that their followers will support them whatever will not last indefinitely. There are reliability and quality control issues with even their flagship models. Fuji and Sony will clear up as Leica lens owners swap over for better or equal sensors and much improved LCD screens and better reliability. Why wouldn’t you ??
The last photo with summicron lens looks photoshopped. The lens is not straight.
my opinion: who really cares about another camera without a real (=optical) viewfinder where weight and size is rated higher than a good user interface
Part of the Leica tour in Solms is the prototype dept. Companies make prototypes that do not make it to market, and I would not be surprised if this were a prototype.
Sony steps up with an amazing full-frame camera in the A7 and Leica decides to step away from their rangefinder design only to jump in with an mirrorless APS-C product. It’s a funny twist.
I think Sony is showing us the way to go. And Sony has been the leader in the design and manufacturing of imaging chips… I believe they are OEM for imaging chips for a vast majority of camera and smart phone manufacturers too. Sony is poised to create a true rift in the continuum. I would be more impressed if Leica gave chase with a full-frame mirrorless design of their own.
The Sony A7 is stealing Leica’s thunder in a strange way. It essentially allows for almost any lens designed for a full-frame camera, digital or film, to be able to be utilized – that’s all of Leica’s high-end lens line! As long as the imaging chip is excellent, and it is – that’s a big threat.
“The Sony A7 is stealing Leica’s thunder in a strange way. It essentially allows for almost any lens designed for a full-frame camera, digital or film, to be able to be utilized – that’s all of Leica’s high-end lens line! As long as the imaging chip is excellent, and it is – that’s a big threat.”
Except most of the Leica lenses do not work well on the Sony.
I have seen poor results over and over again from people who claim otherwise.
No disrespect, but I don’t think Sony is showing us the way to go at all. With a few exceptions, their track record with cameras has been extremely spotty so far… especially when it comes to system & support.
I don’t think the A7 series is the exception. There are too many engineering problems to overcome, and I don’t think Sony has the stamina or know-how to overcome those. Without a radical redesign (read: miniaturization) of full-frame autofocus lenses, the future of mirrorless belongs to M4/3 and/or APS-C.
When Nikon and Canon get in the game in a serious way, they’ll likely be the ones showing us the way forward, since they have the momentum, the experience, and the profitability in camera sales right now. And I expect they will leverage APS-C. In fact, I’ve been told by someone very much in the know that Nikon has considered / is considering a modern digital interpretation of the classic SP rangefinder.
Serious?
What’s to argue? Pretty factual stuff that Robert is saying here.far too much tripe written by so-called internet expert so n the importance of FF anyway, in reality it’s just a white elephant when it comes to taking good photographs on the whole.
I meant that SP plan; that would be a dream come true and blow Leica out of the water. Nikon is not known for using antiquated technology.
But I’m doubting that the plan Robert’s spokesman told him about will become reality; just think of the enormous investment required to build up a appropriate lens line. You just can’t do that halfheartedly.
The person who told me knows the upper echelons of the company. What I was told is that a digital interpretation of the classic Nikon rangefinders is something that has been / or is under consideration. It was unclear as to which.
Now, how serious is that? Who knows? But the idea that it’s crossed their minds seriously enough to confirm such consideration is interesting to me.
Nikon is a very conservative company, however. I’m not sure the bean counters would give a green light to this. On the other hand, they sort of needs a standout product / PR / innovation win right now, since reaction to the Df seems to have been about 55% favorable and 45% unfavorable around the world.
Does it mean they’ll look at this as an opportunity to do something else retro, but this time really do it up right? Who knows…
I’d rather play the tables in Vegas. 🙂
Body and soul. The lack of both gives no connection to my heart. Leica need more aesthetic sens.
Might just as well buy an M adapter for my NEX 6 by the look of this – it has viewfinder, too!
42.5/1.2 Nocticron (for MFT) samples look very good, so similar ventures for their own APS-C camera would not be surprising at all, so I don’t think it’s fake.
If Leica offers the M adapter for this and does the lens corrections like the M240 does and can offer the IQ of A7R in croped mode I’d buy this camera happily. Hope it comes in black too.
gotta be a fake….but then you cant put it past Leica to deliver this.
It is a fake, and a poor one at that. At best it is a rendering from memory, or the description from a second party. I think they’d do well to release a APSC or M4/3 clone of the GX7. That’s a handsome camera.
Indeed, it no doubt is a fake but don’t expect the specs to be too far off. lol
Looks like Leica has bought up old stock of Nex 3 bodies and will put a little red badge on it and charge a Leica price. Primes made in Germany by Leica will cost a bomb, and the rest will be sourced from third party lens manufacturers, again with the usual Leica mark-up.
What is going to set this apart from the high quality APS-C and Micro 4/3rds models from Sony, Olympus and Panasonic? Oh, yes, that little red badge.
Looks like NEX From 3 years ago…than it will probably also have the standards of that!
The only thing that can excite me from Leica, is when they make a leap in the industry, like the S2 was
more or less.
The lenses are ok…The Bodies most of the time overpriced for old technology with marketing
Leica is a company that stands for a number of things, superb optics, high standards of engineering and that elusive feature, soul. Everyone and their grandmother have for decades, tried to emulate the ‘Leica’ look and feel, with varying levels of success. You then have Hassleblad and their new model, a Sony with the ‘tarted up’ dials …. I just hope whoever cobbled that up, comes nowhere near this camera. I remember encountering for the first time in the flesh, the Alpa 12 models, which oozed engineering quality, although it is a very ‘Spartan’ design. http://www.alpa.ch/en/products/cameras/camera-bodies/alpa-12-tc.html
However, this isn’t just one of your run of the mill manufacturers, but it’s a manufacturer which ‘values’ it’s visual appearance and heritage as Leitz does.
The only places I ever hear the term “Leica Look” are sites that talk specifically about Leica cameras. My grandmother had a IIIc and she traded it for an Argus because the bloody thing had a virtually impossible-to-calibrate rangefinder. Too much of a pain for granny… In fact, if you look back, you’ll probably find most other camera companies were trying to emulate what Zeiss was doing optically. Zeiss, in the early years of Leica was actually more highly regarded than Leica. Leica was for a time the “poor man’s Zeiss”.
Not a camera that my part of the world (admittedly very small) is waiting for with baited breath. What we are probably seeing here is the influence of Leica’s new shareholder, that probably sees the mirrorless market as potentially profitable for Leica branded stuff. We’re all, to some degree, status seekers, and shrewd commercial minds recognize that.
It doesn’t look as ridiculous as Hasselblad’s efforts, but do we really need another creditcard like body with realtively huge lenses bolted to it?
Yep, this one will be hitting in April. To be more precise, on April 1st. If hope this is not true, first the X Vario and then this one. Samsung NX`something and NEX` stepchild, one fugly camera.
A pity Leica`s shares are no longer listed on the stock exchange or else I`d sell them short on Monday.
Leica wants to be the Apple of photography… I’m quite sure if this is true that they will also have an adapter for their M lenses.
Hi Steve, Hi dear readers.
I hope Leica will go for a much more interesting and history related product. A M8.2 remake, call it M8.3 would be more than welcome (but it needs to be a rangefinder to have that M).
I’d like to see a good remake like this Zeiss Ikon Concept. (Though I believe they would charge a lot for the premium design..)
http://cargocollective.com/iovokitangra/Ikon-digital-concept-camera
Except that was not actually a Zeiss design. It was just some dude mocking up what he thought it should be. I really could never see Zeiss retooling the Cosina line enough to make that camera a reality. They’d rather just focus on making lenses – and that’s what shutting down the Ikon line did for them.
I have never pretended to say that it’s a Zeiss design. Its a designer project, made keeping in mind the old Ikon. You may like it or not, but I find it more interesting than an x vario camera.
I wish Leica would focus on new models like that, perhaps not taking such huge steps forward in the design (or some people would be shocked..), rather than rebranding Panasonic cameras.
This does not look like a Panasonic rebadged camera. More of a NEX or a Samsung camera.
Definetly not a Leica design.
I see what you mean Marco. I actually was hopeful that Zeiss would see what Leica and Fuji were doing and create some sort of digital rangefinder over at Cosina that would take M-Lenses. I would have invested in that product. But you know how it is, the doctors in charge at Zeiss really didn’t want to push another camera body down the line. They want the lens revenue. Unlike Olympus, Zeiss felt the camera body business was actually taking away resources from their other endeavours and they didn’t feel like competing with Leica, even though they could probably produce a 24mp rangefinder body for half the price of the M240.
very cheap looking and plasticky design, not a poor-man’s but a no-man’s Leica – and i think there will be two sensor dimensions in the future: m43 and fullframe
I do hope these are fakes Steve. It looks awful!
I think Leica needs to stop trading on past glories and passing off antediluvian technology as “bespoke”, or “luxury” … and start truly innovating again.
I doubt they will, however, because photography has evolved into a largely electronics-dominated medium … and the Japanese remain at the cutting edge of that.
Crossing my fingers that I’m wrong with this new product, but after all the “mini-M” hype that preceded the Leica Vario, and then the resultant deflating experience of that release, I’m not hopeful.
Except that Leica really hasn’t innovated much since the introduction of the M3. Many would say a lot of the newer things they did actually took them backwards from that glorious M3 finder and assembly.
My point, exactly.
Amazing they can sell anything at all, isn’t it? Terrible, old outclassed products like the MM, the M240 and the S. And all those terrible, horrible no good lens. I bet they will be bankrupt any day now. Or maybe they can hire all you geniuses and turn things around.
Unfortunately, most of the products you list are indeed outclassed by other manufacturers in key respects; if by “class” you’re referring to specs & performance for the dollar … and not just pretension for its own sake.
The sole exception there being the optics, where I agree Leica glass is uniformly excellent across the entire lineup.
Re “genius”, it was a distinct lack of it that almost led Leica to bankruptcy back in 2006 because they refused to see which way the wind was blowing and embrace digital.
In 2014, I guess it depends on whether Leica wants to sell photographic instruments … or luxury fashion accessories. If it’s the latter, then I’ll agree, their strategy is working brilliantly.
Nothing wrong with that, per se, but let’s not go around pretending that there aren’t more effective tools for the job out there for less money. After all, if Leica’s were so much superior to everyone else, the vast majority of pros would nut-up and buy them.
They don’t.
Totally agree Robert, and nobody is a bigger Leica nut than me.
I recently ditched my Fuji X Pro1 gear for an M9 and must say I am most disappointed. Sure the images, when moon & stars collide, are sublime. But the camera itself is a prehistoric brick and the last firmware update (some 18 months+ ago) is a total disaster which broke discreet mode and led to buffer congestion in many cameras (mine included). I owned several M8’s previously and IMHO it was not exactly a large leap onwards despite being FF etc. Still the shotgun sound shutter and ridiculous wind on.
I both LOVE & HATE the camera and frankly am far too afraid to see my expensive investment turned into a worthless brick that is worth zero.
So back, without any hesitation whatsoever I might add, I will shortly return to the wonderful Fuji X system and the XT-1 & X-Pro1, X100s. Leica electronics v Fuji electronics = NO CONTEST PERIOD.
I will still continue with joy to use my film M’s in the M4 & M6 and may even return to using an R8 or R9 again in the future but as far as I’m concerned I cannot afford to invest crazy money in a Leica digital M system any time soon. It’s just not worth the stress!
All I know is that I use Leica cameras and think they are wonderful. The prints I make are extraordinary, and for my purposes I see nothing else out there that equals them. Everyone is entitled to his or her own opinion, of course. I simply don’t understand why the name Leica generates such extreme positions and leads people to make glaring overstatements and state unsupportable conclusions about the products. I guess I would call it “Leica derangement syndrome”. The company appears to be doing quite well, the products sell well and despite what people here say, there are many pros using them. And by the way, it’s not just the glass but the combination of the glass and the cameras that creates the fine image. When I take my files to the best pros for printing I am told over and over again that the files are extraordinary. Res ipsa loquitor.
jack larson — If Leica suites your shooting style, then absolutely that is the tool you should use. Feeling a synergy with one’s camera can, and does, make a difference to one’s output, whatever brand it may be.
Shooting with the Leica is a different experience and suited to different objectives. It’s a more methodical approach. Nothing wrong with that. But by the same token, it’s not the right choice for photographing the Super Bowl … or wildlife in Africa.
So I’m not sure the statements being made here are glaringly overstated.
Remember that optical quality alone is no longer the sole contributing factor that governs IQ; not to the same extent as it did when film was the medium. Electronics, sensor quality, in-camera software, and post processing techniques have had an equally transformative effect on photography.
Yes, Leica is profitable right now; one of only three manufacturers that can make that claim. You can’t take that away from them. But they’re positioning their products as much as luxury accessories as they are cameras. Nothing wrong with that; it’s working for them. But let’s be honest about it.
As to “extraordinary”, it’s not the technical elements that make a photo extraordinary, it’s the blending of composition, moment, and light. And those three elements can be captured to make extraordinary photos with any quality camera.
It’s not the hammer, it’s the person wielding it.
LOL
I took an M8 and a 135 lens on a photo shoot in Africa. Two friends went with big Canons and Nikons. My pictures are stunning. Theirs are not, and they missed many shots because of auto focus problems or because they were dealing with ridiculous sub menus. I took my M240 to the Walker Cup golf match on Long Island last fall and got terrific pictures of golfers, action shots of their swings etc. I had a press pass and many of the pros with huge Nikon F4s wanted to see the Leica and said that was what they wanted when they could do what they wanted.
There is nothing “dishonest” being said by me about Leica, but I think the uninformed conclusions being offered here about the success or failure of a company based on a leaked and maybe not accurate internet photo are truly absurd. The flaming anti-Leica rhetoric, indeed , reduces down to sheer speculation, bordering on dishonesty.
Leica sales are up. They have built and are moving into a new factory. They have as a financial partner one of the most substantial and successful LBO firms, the products get rave reviews from objective reviewers. And they take great images. I know, I know, it’s not the arrow but the indian that counts. But you get a better result with a great arrow and a good indian.
and than…you wake up !
If you are a Leica Fan, up to you
But making Canon and Nikon users looking like idiot, is pathetic !
Ever seen on a Formula 1 circuit or TT motorcycle circuit a Photographer shooting a F1 Car/Motor who approaching with 275km/hr …and using an Leica M?
If you do…you where really dreaming
M van den Broek. Come on. Grow up. All I pointed out is that Leicas can perform in areas where they are not well suited. And that the complexity of Canons and Nikons can get in the way. I did not reach the sweeping conclusions that the anti- Leica crowd enjoys so much, and you know it. And of course one would not use an M Leica at a motorcycle race or to capture a speeding F1 car. Duh!! Would you use an F4 for street photography and look like a dork?
All cameras are “horses for courses” but the anti Leica crowd wants to comment only on inherent limitations of Leicas and ignore the inherent limitations of all other cameras. Nonsense!
Ok, THAT can of worms. Sure, I’ll bite.
First of all, your stunning images from Africa: I’m sure lots of folks here would love to see them.
I’m not slagging Leica. As to “uninformed conclusions”, I can’t speak for anyone else, but I probably know more about this industry than most folks.
A 1938 Leica III sits in my collection. I’ll be the first in line to say their optics are sublime … taken as an ENTIRE lineup. (But I can show you some specific Nikon and Canon glass that eats Leica’s lunch).
What I’m arguing is that Leica get back to photographic innovation once again. It’s as if when the M3 arrived, they said, “Well, that’s it, folks! This is the pinnacle of camera engineering right here!” and then closed up shop. Their rangefinders haven’t really evolved much since that original design. Imagine if a car manufacturer tried to survive by building incremental improvements to a 1953 model.
The strategy didn’t work. Leitz entirely missed the importance of the SLR in the 1970s, and when sales of rangefinders fell, they introduced the Leicaflex SL. Well, though well built, the specs of that camera couldn’t hold a candle to the Nikon F2 and Canon F1 of the day … so what did Leica do? They turned to Minolta to boost their revenues. And we got the R3 (a rebadged XE-7), etc.
More recently, they’ve turned to Panasonic; rebadging Panny compacts and jacking the price to raise revenue. Nothing wrong with that, but caveat emptor if you’re a buyer.
And all these “fashion” editions telegraph to serious photographers that Leica is more concerned about being a luxury fashion accessory than being the serious photographic instrument upon which they originally built their reputation more than a half century ago.
Combine those previous two issues together and you can understand why a lot of serious shooters get irked by some of Leica’s choices.
But you’re absolutely right, they’re making money right now … so more power to them.
I actually really love what Leica has done with the S series, and I’d like to see more of that. The problem with the S is that it’s not quite sure what it wants to be. It’s a medium format camera in a DSLR body, and while it performs brilliantly at the former, it falls woefully behind at the latter; autofocus speed being a chief example.
The other thing Leica does exceptionally well — that beats the Japanese manufacturers all to hell, IMHO — is design. Not just industrial design, but the design of menus. This is another area where the S excels, in fact.
Anyway, shoot what you love. But if you’re expecting using a Leica camera to visibly improve the quality of your images, then you’re drinking the Kool-Aid.
I think I will believe what I see with my own eyes as far as picture are concerned. No need for you to be insulting and tell me I am drinking Kool-aid. I think you are simply a jaw flapper who repeats the know nothing statements of others you read on the web. I doubt that you have shot with an M240, an MM or even the S. Your statement about the S is a good example of what I am talking about. Your “authoritative” statement that “the S is not quite sure what it wants to be” is a perfect example of what I am talking about. t sounds so clever and conveys an air of expertise and negative criticism but actually says nothing. And you know full well that the S is specifically designed to combine an SLR with medium format. By the way Leica is pleased with the market performance of the S and believes that it has a 20% (and growing) market share.
I suggest you shoot what you want and let us Leica guys shoot what we want and just get on with life.
No need to be defensive. There’s nothing wrong with shooting Leica [or any other brand].
But I stick to the facts and the numbers [and years of experience] … not hyperbole.
Of course, everyone is free to believe whatever they want. Happy shooting…
Marketing wise, there is no room for yet another APS mirrorless offering. Most of the existing ones have already a kind of ‘premium’ pricing, being more expensive than similar DSLR offerings. A premium premium makes no commercial sense to me. Unless Leica comes up with something really differentiating (and I don’t mean differentiating in the Hasselblad sense).
The most sensible route would be to create a full frame mirrorless lineup that complements the M. A modern system with autofocus, but fully compatible with the M lenses, and sharing some of the core technologies like the sensor to reduce development and manufacturing costs. Pricing could fall in between the Sony A7 and the current M.
On the differentiating front, I could think of a truly oversized sensor m43, that will allow to shoot from 16:9 up to 1:1 aspect ratio at full image circle. Just put a D7100 sensor in a m43 body, and you’re nearly there. You’ll have the dynamic range of the Nikon, but the system size of m43. The price is that you have to crop before shooting away, instead of after the fact.
Can’t be real, for a number of reasons.
#1-Leica is apparently making this new camera with Panasonic, so it would not likely look like a NEX.
#2-APS-C is probably correct, but again, look at this form, not Leica, and DEF not Panasonic.
#3-I imagine it will look something like the GX-7…
#4-I know nothing, but why is Leica going this route? APS-C…with Panny, could be amazing, could be another point and shoot dud.
#5-If they are going to make an interchangeable lens camera, in partnership with Panasonic, it just might be amazing.
I agree with some of what you postulate….
The image does not appear to be a Panasonic influenced design. Panasonic is the company collaborating with Leica for the “T” type camera. That is definite.
http://www.43rumors.com/new-leica-camera-registration-is-it-a-mft-or-aps-c-camera
Also, if Panasonic is possibly rebranding the GX-7 with Leica (which I have read on the web as a rumor)…where does the APS-C idea come from. Panasonic’s largest sensor is MFT? I do not see Panasonic magically producing a camera with a sensor size that has nothing in common with every ILC camera that they have produced over recent years. That seems kind of far-fetched to me.
This looks like MFT. 23mm lens would make a nice 46mm standard equivalent. 35mm is popular, but the only default Leica focal length.
Doubt it. Even when Leica puts out a Panasonic variation they at least improve the design of the Camera! This is another one of those Sony mockups, too ugly for Leica.
My hope is that is will be a variation on the Vario body design, with a built in view finder (or at least a high res option). Perhaps with a sensor the same size as in the M8 just to be different.
And a M-Mount adapter 🙂
But… if it is small sensor why are you going to pay for Leica lenses? You get them for the bokeh (yeah, but an old Russian Zeiss copy gives you that) but there is no need to worry about the edges because the sensor is not that big.
My Ricoh GXR with a M mount does the same job… unless the sensor is something special, and I don;’t think it will be.
Speaking of the sensor, the guy who runs Leica said in a magazine interview a few months ago that they were interested in exploring b&w-only sensors a bit more. Maybe this is it.
Henry,
Very interesting, but I don’t really see the sense. A b&w only sensor can be optimised for this, but to produce a b&w only APS-C camera, that will have very limited appeal and which will require investment in a whole new range of lenses to avoid the crop factor of current Leica lenses, and coupled with the inevitable Leica high price would be a massive gamble.
I wonder how many MM’s were sold in comparison to the colour M’s? And this is a body for which a range of lenses already existed.
Oops, sorry typo. Harvey.
What a Leica user to be is after? The Leica lenses. What a seasoned Leica photographer wishes for? To use both R and M lenses on a fully compatible modern but minimal digital body with a top of the line viewfinder, having the option of a couple of excellent standard f AF Leica zooms. What the market seems to adopt? What’s the current trend beyond DSLR? The mirrorless EVF camera. What is Leica’s strong point? Retro. Then a Leicaflex looking mirrrorless Full Frame would be the real hit. Otherwise with Sony, Fuji and Olympus around what a NEX looking Leica has really to offer? Not so much I guess.
Dimitris V. Georgopoulos
Photographer at Large
Athens, Greece.
Well, at least it is quite compact and I’m sure would be much sharper than mediocre 24/1.8
Are you referring to the Sony Zeiss 24/1.8 Sonnar? There is nothing mediocre about that lens.
>Are you referring to the Sony Zeiss 24/1.8 Sonnar?
>There is nothing mediocre about that lens.
Indeed. “Fork” seems to be trolling, me thinks… IF he were serious, I would be expecting some proof, and not innuendo… and experience tells me that the 24mm f/1,8 is quite decent, in fact one of the ‘best’ native lenses for NEX/APS-C.
Is it just me or does that look a lot like a nex? Haha
Sony takes a swing at Leica and Leica swings right back. HAHA. 🙂
Before I read a thing, I thought, Sony Nex, which is already an old system. If this is real, it’s proof they aren’t doing anything new. APS-C in a mirrorlews system. Yawn! Even Sony has moved beyound this with the new A7 series. Show us something new and unique Leica. If this is true, it’s hardly worth a review or right up unless there is something amazing under the hood. Which I doubt.
Ugly, ugly, ugly. If this is real….it’s a big fail.
Although I would REALLY like to step into the Leica world, this one doesn’t appeal to me at all. Budgetwise, I personally would rather pick up a used M8 to get some Leica sensation and stick to M43 as my main platform. Besides, my Pana 25mm also says it’s Leica…
That’s not a bad idea. I’ve had an M8 in the past, and I liked it fine. If I were to go Leica again, I’d probably go M9 just to get full frame. But the M9 has stayed pretty darn expensive on the used market, so it’s still not that attractive to me.
Mostly I’m just over Leica’s crazy-high prices and lack of meaningful innovation. Now, more than ever, the digital M series and its lenses are Veblen Goods, as are the aftermarket products that surround the M line. Nothing wrong with that, but it makes it less attractive to me these days.
This isn’t hate. I still think of Leica is the iconic camera brand. I used to own a M2 in addition to my M8, and I still own an R8, and have enjoyed all of them (and bought them all very used).
Speaking of R-cameras, I still have that magical 19mm f:2.8 ver. II R-lens that keeps on screaming for an R-body! However, I don’t want to go shooting film no more for several reasons. The M8 would give me an affordable opportunity to sense that Leica rangefinder feeling “everybody” is propagating. I definitely agree with you about the M9 being too expensive, if I would want FF, I’d go Sony or Nikon nowadays.
@Roeland:
Put it on an Alpha 7-body (A7/A7R). Take a good adapter – Novoflex or Fotodiox are working well – and enjoy. Experience tells me that you will. I had the Elmarit-R 19mm f/2,8 Type II on trial for the last two weekends. Pity that my photo hobby budget for this year is burned already – it is on my shopping list now. And it is better than my 19mm Type I – by a noticeable margin.
Regards,
Michael
=->